[We are] not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. (Romans 1:16)

Thursday, December 20, 2007

What does it mean to believe that Elizabeth II is the Queen?

by Matthew

A child may know that Elizabeth II is Queen of Great Britain. She may not, however, be aware that this makes her Queen of Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Jamaica, Barbados, the Bahamas, Grenada, Papua New Guinea, the Solomon Islands, Tuvalu, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Antigua and Barbuda, Belize, and Saint Kitts and Nevis, Head of the Commonwealth, the chief of state of Great Britain, the possesor of the residual prerogative powers, the head of the House of Windsor, formerly Saxe-Coburg Gotha, the fount of all honours, the Defender of the Faith, and the Supreme Governor of the Church of England.

Likewise, there are a number of things entailed by Jesus being the Christ, the Son of God. Some people believe some of these things while rejecting others.

The important question is, what is essential for a person to believe in Jesus as Christ and Son of God in a salvific way?


  • I took my daughter to see the queen when she was in town a couple of years ago. Of course we didn't get very close and had to watch her on a big screen.

    But the majesty of that experience alone was enough to draw thousands. With what can we compare the coming glory and majesty of our King of kings and Lord of lords.

    God bless,

    By Blogger Jim, at Thursday, December 20, 2007 12:43:00 PM  

  • Very true.

    By Blogger Dyspraxic Fundamentalist, at Thursday, December 20, 2007 12:45:00 PM  

  • Matt,

    you have really asked a question that has very much relevence in today's gospel debate.

    There are many legitimate imports to the title "Christ" as well as "Son of God".

    It is telling that John, in both his gospel and his first epistle, interchange their use.

    The Samaritans believe that Jesus is the Christ. The man born blind believes that Jesus is the Son of God. And Martha believes that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God.

    You notice that Martha uses both titles appositionally, meaning that they are indeed equivalent.

    Questions arise, too many to enumerate here. For instance, 1 John 5:1 states that whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God. There are no exceptions to this. Must we not infer that this is sufficient? Certainly the language used implies such. This leads to the question, can someone not hear that Jesus is the Son of God and believe that He is the Christ and be born from above? Certainly the language of 1 John 5:1 says so!

    It is better to realize that these two titles are equivalent, and we must also recognize that the title "Christ" is given priority.

    There is good evidence, (OT, intertestemental, and NT) that show that the title "Son of God" is a messianic title, rather than one of deity.

    But the fact of the matter is that there are many legitimate, and possible imports to these titles.

    To pick only one (as our friend Jon Lee has) and latch on to it to the exclusion of the rest, which, in my opinion, some have greater testimony to, is rather arbitrary.

    I am fascinated to learn that the Queen is associated with so many territories. I knew of a few but not so many!

    When it comes to the idea of understanding Jesus to be the Christ, the Son of God, as a consideration of saving faith, there are only a few options open to us:

    1) A single soteric element in the midst of many legitimate imports (ex: As the Christ, Jesus guarantees eternal life to all who believe in Him for it)
    2) A combination of soteric elements in the midst of many legitimate imports (ex: Believe that Jesus is the priest who has offered Himself as a sacrifice for sins, and the king of Israel and you are saved)
    3) The necessity of all legitimate imports to be known, thus making them all soteric (self explanatory)
    4) The recognition of only one legitimate import, with no necessity of which one. (Ex: believe that Jesus is the king of Israel and you are saved, or believe that Jesus was the prophet to come and you are saved, etc.)

    The question here is going to come down to which one of these 4 has the biblical support. Jon Lee can say that his new soteriological view stems from number one, but I would say that in all reality, his view belongs in number 4. Why? There is no statement in the whole of the bible that states that eternal life, or eternal salvation, or justification is conditioned on believing in the deity of Christ. Therefore, Jon has arbitrarily picked the import of "The Christ, the Son of God" that he desired, and made it a sufficient soteric content.

    #1 with its example has the peculiar consideration of being the one that has the biblical support.

    Everywhere in the NT you will see that "believing in" Jesus is the sole condition for everlasting life, eternal salvation, and justification.

    While never is it conditioned on believing that Jesus died on the cross or that He is God.


    By Blogger Antonio, at Thursday, December 20, 2007 5:59:00 PM  

  • Thanks for your excellent comment, Antonio.

    I am sure many people will be helped by your answer to this question.

    God Bless


    By Blogger Dyspraxic Fundamentalist, at Friday, December 21, 2007 12:44:00 AM  

  • God's

    How can you know what God's Riches are if you don't know the expense and the One Who paid it.

    Seems you wish to teach men GR.

    Without the ACE. Never leave the ACE card out of the deck.


    or you may find you have a losing deck, and if you try to tear the beautiful embroidery in half then you do not have the complete picture, no matter how many seem to accept it.

    Are you sure you havent developed a phobia of the cross because of the Roman Catholic background that perverts it?

    Much in the same way many Charasmatics abuse the wonderful person of the Holy Spirit?

    Satan is clever. He has been arguing for thousands of years. Remember that. In the end...truth will win out in spite of his craft and power as Greater is the Lord who reigns and through his tender mercies has given us the true picture of Grace.

    By Blogger Only Look, at Friday, December 21, 2007 8:48:00 AM  

  • Antonio what happened? You sure have aged lately...

    By Blogger Jim, at Friday, December 21, 2007 9:01:00 AM  

  • Brian, what exactly does it mean to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God? And how would you support your answer?

    By Blogger Dyspraxic Fundamentalist, at Friday, December 21, 2007 11:38:00 AM  

  • Jesus is the Christ.

    Christ means Messiah...Annointed one. It carries the entire meaning of I AM THAT I AM that even the woman at the well was partially understanding and came into complete understanding when He told her I Am He that stands before you having addressed her need because of her sin in trying to find her answer in her many husbands and the broken cisterns that existed there.

    The Son of God means that He is begotten of the Father and came forth from His existence having existed with him from eternity always knowing that he would face the terror of facing the wrath of His Father one day and finally completing this at the cross. The whole Samaritan community was looking for a Messiah and someone outside of themself to deliver them from their need which they understood a little more completely than the Jews did because of being under the condemnation of the Law which had been passed down from generation to generation by way of the Jews who year after year celebrated the passover that had the purpose of bringing all men to understand that they needed the blood of a perfect lamb to deliver them from the angel of death.

    It all completes the picture that they were looking toward in both the Samaritan Community as well as the Jewish.

    They all knew they needed a Messiah and Saviour and their picture came into completion at the cross where the Jews finally began to understand and believe because of it while the surrounding countries understood more clearly because they did not belong to the nation that was looking to temporal reign.

    Matthew. Jesus told a story to back up the meaning of the word "neighbor" when challenged by a lawyer as to its legal meaning.

    There is no loophole between Christ and Him crucified as God spent untold ages sealing this truth with His story since the dawn of time. I encourage you to begin giving the parables a little more credibility in not dismissing them as unwarranted stories to unleash true understanding and doctrine. I am not going to fall into the "And who is my neighbor" trap.

    It is imperitive that we lay down the true story and call men to believe in the God of the true story.

    By Blogger Only Look, at Friday, December 21, 2007 1:54:00 PM  

  • This comment has been removed by the author.

    By Blogger Only Look, at Friday, December 21, 2007 2:12:00 PM  

  • The bottom line is this:

    You and Antonio are ignoring Pauls words in Acts 17:30

    "But Now"

    Those are very important words. God is telling us here that the times of ignorance in the past is not going to be overlooked as it once was and now that he has so richly poured His Son out on the altar and finished His work, he is calling all men everywhere to repent and believe this beautiful truth.

    The danger that this blog represents is that you are telling men and women that it is alright to drift away from understanding the eternal riches made known in these last days in Christ.

    It is not hard though...all we have to tell people is:

    "You need a Saviour because you have sinned against God and violated HIm and your sin cost Christ's sacrifice at Calvary, but Believe on Him and you will be saved."

    Now I said that in one sentence. If people have a hard time accepting that then it gives me opportunity to elaborate on why Christ went to the cross on our behalf.

    By Blogger Only Look, at Friday, December 21, 2007 2:13:00 PM  

  • Hi Matthew

    I believer that Jesus is "The Christ" 1 John 5:1.

    Therefore I'm born of God!

    Based solely on Jesus promise!

    John 6:47 Jesus speaking: Most assuredly I tell you he who believes in Me has eternal life.

    Therefore I have eternal life!

    This is to believe in Jesus as the One who guarantees my eternal destiny. If I die I will live, meaning Jesus will resurrect my body.
    And since I'm alive and believe, I will never die. That's to say I have eternal life and eternal life is eternal! (John 3:16;5:24;6:47;11:25-26)

    I agree with Antonio's statement:

    It is better to realize that these two titles are equivalent, and we must also recognize that the title "Christ" is given priority.

    There is good evidence, (OT, intertestemental, and NT) that show that the title "Son of God" is a messianic title, rather than one of deity.

    I also believe that in the context of 1 John 5:1 we know who our brothers and sisters are! Therefore anyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God!

    blessings alvin

    By Blogger alvin, at Saturday, December 22, 2007 9:40:00 AM  

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