[We are] not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. (Romans 1:16)

Saturday, November 11, 2006

3 Options: Believe you are Saved Eternally, Believe you are Saved Conditionally, Unsure

by Antonio da Rosa

If someone does not understand that salvation is eternal, a once-for-all DEFINITIVE salvation, what are the options?

Flow chart:

Either they believe it is a definitive eternal salvation by faith alone in Jesus or not

If definitive and eternal, then only can be by faith alone into Christ (free gift, free grace)

If not definitevely eternal, then it must be conditional on something OTHER than faith alone into Christ (If it is not a once and for all done deal resulting in an eternal salvation, then there must necessarily be other conditions, not a immediate appropriation of eternal life by the simple exercise of faith)

what are the options?

1) a perseverance in faith
2) a perseverance in obedience
3) keep from sinning mortal sins
4) a combination of the above

In the flow chart I came up with two absolutes:

Either one believes that it is eternal, or one believes that it is conditional

What of the one who is not sure if it is eternal or conditional (like the Arminian and Calvinistic schemes)? He has FAILED to believe, for faith = certainty ONE WAY OR THE OTHER

Christ says:

1) You will never hunger
2) You will never thirst
3) You will never perish
4) You will never come into judgement
5) You can never be plucked from His hands
6) You will never die, into eternity
7) You will be resurrected

How can one say one believes Christ when he is fundamentally denying His salvific promise?


  • Good points Antonio. Some people are saying we're front-loading the gospel by making eternal security a core issue in our Gospel presentation. As you've rightly pointed out, believing into Christ must be purposeful - and the purpose is receiving eternal life. That being the case, we should most definitely make it clear that as a present possession, eternal life really is eternal! Irrevocable! It's obviously easy to explain, so it shouldn't be a problem to make sure people understand eternal life is eternal.

    1 John 5:10-11 He who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; he who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed the testimony that God has given of His Son. 11 And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son

    By Anonymous danny, at Saturday, November 11, 2006 11:59:00 PM  

  • I like what Dr. Thomas Constable has to say in his notes on 1 John 5:11-12 at soniclight.com

    This is the content of God's testimony. Eternal life is inseparable from the
    person of Jesus Christ. Some of the false teachers seem to have tried to
    separate them (cf. 2:25-26). Jesus Christ and eternal life are one gift from

    By Anonymous danny, at Sunday, November 12, 2006 12:18:00 AM  

  • Very logical.

    By Blogger Dyspraxic Fundamentalist, at Sunday, November 12, 2006 1:08:00 AM  

  • Antonio and Matthew,

    There is a Lordship/FreeGrace debate happening right now at CARM on the "Systematic Theology" board. You guys might want to check it out. Ironically, screen name is Free Grace over there. Anyway, there are two active threads on the subject going on. I'd give you the link so you can read what has been said, but you have to be a registered user to view the boards and participate. Here is a little snippet:
    Lordship / free grace - definitions

    I felt that the last thread was all over the place LOL (like usual) so I decided to focus it a bit more here.

    John posted up this radio show and so I'm gonna start from there.

    First off John, it's good to know I've got a neighbor here on the board. I'm in Ontario Ca, just about 40 min north of you on the toll roads 133/241.
    I do appreciate your posts though I'm not sold on your ES views.

    I felt that the radio show was not accurate in as much as the lorshippers are not accurate in stating "free gracers mean you can be a wicked man and inherit the kingdom of God".

    (Here is the first reply. It is the newest of the two threads so this is the only reply yet)



    Originally Posted by auggybendoggy
    What is Lordship salvation and NON lordship salvation?

    Well, I'm not a professor, but have read a lot and will give it a stab.

    Non-Lordship salvation would be antinomian. It teaches that you can accept Jesus as your savior and not as your Lord.

    If you simply accept Jesus, say the sinners prayer or whatever, then you are saved no matter how sinful you live. You are a carnal Christian who hasn't yet put Jesus on the throne of your life. They take the "once saved always saved doctrine" and twist it to "once you simply take Jesus as your savior (even if it is in hypocrisy) then you are saved and always will be."

    Lordship salvation simply says: He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4

    It does not teach that you become sinless or perfect, but that there is an inward change that now wants to obey and strives in that direction.

    Non-Lordship salvation would say that that inward change is not necessary and only comes if or when you finally decide to accept Jesus as Lord.

    At least that is how I see it.

    Pittying ES vs lorship is not accurate (though the says that late in the segment, some people are LS and not works oriented). John Mcarthur is one who is a 5 point reformed and believes in lordship.

    So I'll start here.

    What is Lordship salvation and NON lordship salvation?
    I'm not toally sure of the definitions but I would like someone learned to comment on this. I feel Johns radio show host was not very accurate on the whole lordship vs ES.

    so getting to accurate definitions is important.



    "Some people are saying we're front-loading the gospel by making eternal security a core issue in our Gospel presentation."

    That is exactly what you are doing. Please feel free to come over to my site and stomp on why you think I am in error in saying this. And by the way, I am not the only one who says this.

    By Blogger Gojira, at Sunday, November 12, 2006 11:21:00 AM  

  • Great post, Antonio, very clarifying.

    (Hi Gojira)

    By Blogger H K Flynn, at Tuesday, November 14, 2006 8:33:00 AM  

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